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BlackBerry considering sale of company?

| August 12, 2013 | 185 Replies

Screen Shot 2013-08-12 at 16.06.54

Whilst not directly Nokia related, the story of BlackBerry as a once dominant platform mimics Nokia’s journey in some ways. Both dominant in the past but one ditching their base OS platform for something new and another holding on to it for all it was worth. Now many love to reminisce at Nokia’s OSes (I love to do that for Maemo) and dream of a Nokia that could have been. Once BB10 was released, many wished Nokia could have held onto its own platform and be a strong comeback kid like BlackBerry seemed to be.

But as TheVerge says, the new OS hasn’t stopped BB bleeding marketshare, “both the dominant Android and the growing Windows Phone platforms are chipping away at what’s left of BlackBerry’s base.” Whilst the aim oF Nokia/MS wasn’t high initially, it was something attainable – getting to third position with the relatively unknown WP/Lumia. They’ve done that

A few weeks ago, Janne wrote an interesting piece.

http://mynokiablog.com/2013/07/28/mnb-rg-does-bb-need-to-die-in-order-for-nokiawp-to-live-is-it-a-zero-sum-game/

Better the devil you know.

Here’s the Press Release that details the committee that’s looking to explore BB’s options.

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http://www.marketwire.com/press-release/blackberry-board-of-directors-announces-exploration-of-strategic-alternatives-nasdaq-bbry-1819770.htm Via: TheVerge

Who should buy BlackBerry? HP? We do love what they did to WebOS

Samsung? What’s happening to Tizen? Apparently Sammy wants to distance themselves from Android despite the strong position there. And I read somewhere of Sammy getting a BBM app.

Microsoft? Just to stop someone else getting BB. They already have Nokia to do what they need hardware wise.

Lenovo?

Google already has Motorola.

Nokia? Some say they should merge with BB but why. Nokia’s also just been on a spending spree with NSN. Though it would be somewhat nice to see those swipe things going back to Nokia.

From JoyOfTech (via TheVerge comments)

joy of tech

http://www.geekculture.com/joyoftech/joyarchives/1571.html

Nokia’s position of growth maybe ‘mediocre’ (favourite word by some of our commenters) but at least it’s there. Nokia’s getting love and praise for their Lumia devices, most recently the camera in the 1020 is killing it out there. All we’re waiting for now is for Nokia to unleash the potential of WP. Easier said than done. But it’s still a possibility.

Cheers Alvester for the tip!

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Category: Nokia

About the Author ()

Hey, thanks for reading my post. My name is Jay and I'm a medical student at the University of Manchester. When I can, I blog here at mynokiablog.com and tweet now and again @jaymontano. We also have a twitter and facebook accounts @mynokiablog and  Facebook.com/mynokiablog. Check out the tips, guides and rules for commenting >>click<< Contact us at tips(@)mynokiablog.com or email me directly on jay[at]mynokiablog.com
  • Heron

    Easier said than done indeed.

    BB probably is looking at Nokia and thinking that they may just stage a mini comeback like what Nokia did. But BB were never good at consumer stuff like Nokia was. All it was good at was the enterprise crowd.

    Nokia currently has the power of MS now for enterprise software while still retaining that bit of design and hardware mojo. And slowly, WP is getting there to feature and apps parity.

    BB is dying a slow death if they remain as they are with no real breakthrough.

    • sunny

      what about the fact that, if Nokia merges with BlackBerry they can combine software solutions and innovative a No-Bl. watch? with bbm on the go? if they could have really smarter voice recognition, the good cam that Nokia has, along with android support (which has also they dont) they will get out of losses in 3 months.

      • ben

        Android support will not help. So please shut up

    • jiipee

      According to Kantar Blackberry’s US market share grew 57% QonQ!

  • ms.nokia

    But if BB was doing well then there would be hundreds of comments here telling us all how wrong Nokia’s strategy is and how eflop is an M$ trojan sent to sabotage Nokia.

    • http://twitter.com/haranguemnb Harangue

      But… but… but, it is wrong what Nokia is doing. They don’t even own their own OS now. BB10 can run all Android apps and it came with a bigger launch portfolio of apps than WP which is still floundering after 3 years being in the market.

      In the end it doesn’t matter, I’ll buy Jolla. I just bought a $200 T-Shirt and will get my device bu the end of Q3, or Q4, or early next year, or when they feel like they want to give me one. One thing I’ll never do is buy Nokia again, not as long as they sell that childs OS put there by that Trojan €flop.

      • Random Random

        Oh, you have already bought that?

        Can you post some sample pictures? Perhaps tomorrow if you can’t do it today?

      • ms.nokia

        haha yes absolutely true :)

      • ben

        Retard child os you mean android. Go and buy s**** phones. Nothing compare to Nokia. Like it or not windows phone and Nokia are here to stay. Flustering rubbish more like growing for the past 3 years. By next year you wont be laughing anymore, you will be crying with your Samsung or dead blackberry. While Nokia grows and windows phone grows. High market share, high sales, high customers, apps growed, software improvements, pefrect ecosystem, beautiful UI you are going to miss all of that plus the big processors.

  • linkin

    Maybe this is the time to start appreciating elop’s efforts….

    • BEN

      AGREE.

    • Timo

      For what??? For turning Nokia into No 11th from 1st? Idiots.

      • jiipee

        Well He didnt close down NSN manufacturing and start as a Huawei reseller. Now they at least get money from networks ;)

      • linkin

        most people have a personal dislike for elop because they see him as a microsoft trojan…nokia was sitting on a time bomb and so was elop and any decision he made was always going to affect nokia..elop didnt turn nokia to 11th,nokia did.people talk like evergthing elop did was wrong,aside the burning platform memo(which only helped to hasten the decline of an already dying symbian),elop did nothing wrong.now that his strategy is showing signs of success,people should appreciate him and stop being biased and short sighted.

        • jiipee

          “stop being … and short sighted.”

          Exatly my point. Elop has disarmed Nokia from the operations that could bring money in the future (unless there is something truly amazing cooking up in CTO organization) and made them a sole OEM, which owns a separate company with networks business.

          No license revenue in the future, just low margin device sales where Microsoft reaps the harvest of their ecosystem.

          • ben

            Stop being short sightened. Nokia has a bright future with wp. Nokia is not dead, it is still the worlds 2nd biggest mobile manufacturer. The sales are growing in their smartphones. So please what would Nokia do, stick with lackluster Symbian, meego

            • jiipee

              What I wrote there was +5 years time frame. You are talking about WP in a year or two.

              I did not argue againts that WP will get some market share via Nokia. The difference is that MS owns the ecosystem and hence the margins in long term.

              • BEN

                no I am talking about WP right now and next year not in a year or two, you are bringing out WP slow sales back in 2010 & 2011.

                • jiipee

                  Exactly. I am saying that Nokia will get in profits in a year or so. Then after two years o so they will fix their position as OEM in MS’s ecosystem, where they will get narrow margins and MS takes the bulk of profits and covers most of the device categories.

          • linkin

            what do you mean disarm??nokia already disarmed itself by not reinventing symbian and being too lax at the top.elop inherited a stale n dying nokia,he only told the world d truth.seems people would never agree to anything he does,as long as he remains elop but that would never matter,as long as nokia gets back to the top and keeps connecting people.and what licence revenue are you talking about??people rarely remember google owns andriod and samsung is makin billions runnin a borrowed ecosystem,why would nokia be different?u knw,if elop had gone with andriod,many,many people would still criticize,its human nature.

            • jiipee

              Mr Linkin. For records sake, I dont disagree that Nokia failed Symbian development bad. Neither is I am of the opinion that Nokia shouldnt have adopted external OS.

              What I disagree with is that they completely shut down own OS development (except S40 core with Smarterphone), which they could have kept with very small annual cost. From business point of view all-in-strategies are extremely risky. Luckily NSN saved Nokia’s ass.

              “seems people would never agree to anything he does”. I dont know, which ‘people’ you mean. I have given Elop credit on his competence on empowering employees and making decisions. Strategic thinking (hero wannabe) and vision do not seem to be his strong areas.

              • linkin

                mr jipee,i was actually replying to mr timo,when i said ‘people’ i meant those that criticise blindly.u still believed nokia could have revived symbian?well,they had a board of directors who could have changed that if they felt d need to,wel its ok,jipee understands elop has tried.

                • jiipee

                  Nokia could have revived Symbian back in 2005-2008, but did not.

                  • Random Random

                    Yes, that’s true. That was pretty much the time frame they had. In 2008 there was still a slight chance but not too big.

                    Instead of giving Nokia the idea of reviving the Symbian the Nokia fans praised Symbian and told how it was superior to iPhone OS.

                    This was a nice reminder about that.

                    http://mynokiablog.com/2013/08/13/timetraveltuesday-nokia-n95-vs-iphone-crickey-the-n95-was-sooo-good/

                    How was Nokia supposed to to know that they should start turning Symbian into a modern smartphone OS when the fans were just telling them how happy they were?

                    Nokia was also too arrogant to notice that without people telling that to them.

                    I’m actually doing a favor when I point out the flaws Nokia has. A favor like people back in 2008 should have done.

                    Yes, they should also fire the excess weigh. People like Marko Ahtisaari. That’s a good tip for Nokia.

                    • http://mynokiablog.com Jay Montano

                      http://mynokiablog.com/2008/02/13/the-real-s60-touch/

                      The Real S60 Touch: Nokia fans prepare for an anticlimax.

                      We weren’t all blindly singing praises for Symbian. I already had my concerns way back when too. Though some accuse me of only thinking like this because of WP. Shame.

                      “Personally, I’m somewhat embarrassed to be a Nokia fan. Since the dawn of the “iPhone phenomenon”, we knew that once S60 touch is unveiled, it would be immediately compared to the iPhone. I felt that the only way Nokia could make an impact into the new paradigm of a touch UI if they could to replicate something similar to their concept video of Nokia Touch UI as seen some years ago. I had a lot of expectations.”

                    • Random Random

                      Yes, it’s true that not everyone was not blindly praising Symbian. Unfortunately for Nokia you were a too rare exception. You were able to see the reality just like you were able to see it with WP.

                      Yes.

                      It’s really unfortunately that not every Nokia fan is as talented as you are. This is not a joke. I really mean it. It’s really unfortunate.

                      From that link of your, there is only one comment to be picked but it’s actually a good one. At the time it was not rare to hear people commenting how this was only a beginning and how Nokia would definitely ship a killer product soon enough. Definitely.

                      Unfortunately all that made Nokia’s management to believe in the faery tales the fans and the Symbian R&D fabricated.

                      Yes.

                      The Symbian R&D actually fabricated (at the time) to the top management.

                      Also this is also not a joke.

                  • linkin

                    They did not,right.that brings to the same place we started..meaning they needed something drastic cause reinvention became too late.

      • ben

        For being better. Its all about being first. It is about investing great ecosystem and going in a new different direction. Thinking outside of these box. So please shut up, Nokia is still one of the worlds biggest mobile phone manufacturer. So what do you know, nothing about the ceo or Nokia. Don’t talk childish BS.

        • jiipee

          Try to relax!

          • BEN

            @Jiippe f**** your the one needs to go to English classes thank you. By the way its still Summer retard.

            • http://mynokiablog.com Jay Montano

              Watch your language please. Insults and profanity are not welcome in the comments, regardless of anyone’s position/opinion.

  • D Harries

    It is very hard for brand value like Apple or Facebook to grow any more. They’re the success that they are. How do you grow any more? Investment wise, you need to start lower down, something that isn’t obvious now, but has somewhere to go.

    Would Nokia bring back making phones to Finland?

  • Glass

    Just goes to show that being able to run Android apps doesn’t matter all that much.

    • muhs

      +1
      most people wanted meego for that reason

      • http://deckfromacard.wordpress.com Otto

        …something that Nokia did not plan to do (support for Android apps to MeeGo). They acknowledged the possibility but felt the benefits would rain to pockets of Google.

        • Thomas F

          Is it better that the benefits go to MS? And almost not sell any smart phones for 2 years?

          • Random Random

            MeeGo would have also started from zero sales, just like WP did.

            It wouldn’t have been that different with MeeGo but it would have cost more.

            • Thomas F

              1.Meego could have had all the Android Apps form day one, that is a major difference, After 2 years of waiting WP is still struggling for the apps.

              2. And the N9 had a good start both in sales numbers, and reputation and press comments. It was however only sold in a small number of countries and no major markets were included. And of cause it was also announsed dead the day they launched it. It did not outsell the L800, but it outsold the L800 in the markets where they were sold side by side.

              3. Symbian and the burning platform was Nokias biggest error, the communication and the way this was done was FUBAR. You don kill your cash Cow before the new product is in place… Symbian was gaining market share before the announcement, and the sales droped like a stone just a few weeks after. ( Yes symbina needed a replacement, that could have been handled different.

              4. Why did Nokia not go for more than 1 Smartphone OS, ALL other major producers have.

              If Nokia gets through this, it is not due to Elop but due to the incredible people working every day at Nokia cleaning up after him, and sending one brilliant piece of hardware after the other to the market, making people by the phones despite the OS and lack of apps.

              • BIG

                Sturggling for apps bs. Window phone has over 65% top apps from ios and Android, top developers are bring big apps this fall, vine,flipbook,path etc. It has improved last year, it has 170,000 I would never call wp lack of apps in terms of numbers. So shut up.

                2 nd windows phone beaten BlackBerry apps and markets share and its the 3rd biggest operating system in the world and 3rd most shipped smartphone operating system that meego would never reach

                Real ecosystem rich from microsoft office,xbox,skydrive, etc.

                Last of all nokia smartphone sales were zero in 2010 to a massive growth in every quarter since the deal with Microsoft. So elop strategy worked, what do you know about business. Look at lumia sales growth, sales were tiny a year ago from 2 million in q2 to nearly 10 million in a quarter and every month is growing. So please what go with android and meego and kill it self. It would been dead. Nobody dev knows meego properly, crap quality apps ported android, lack of services and ecosystem in meego & that dead symbian that bearly good for today’s standards. So please shut up

                • Thomas F

                  Shut up? Strangeway to prove a point…. Something to do with low self confidence ?

                  • ben

                    Low self esteem do you know that means retard who don’t know nothing about operating systems and Nokia and business

                    • jiipee

                      Good thing that Summer vacations are soon over. You need to attend your English classes.

              • Krishna

                Well said… After using 720 n 520…i feel sad for nokia …excellent phones crippled by wp …

                • Random Random

                  WP is better than Symbian.

                  Back in 2010 people really really hated Symbian.

                  It was a horrible OS.

                  • Thomas F

                    But meegowasgrate, and stit is…

                    • Random Random

                      MeeGo was pretty much destined to start from zero.

              • Random Random

                1. There is absolutely no proof that Nokia was going to make MeeGo Android compatible from day one.

                Another matter is that MeeGo was never going to have access to Google Play. That was just not possible. Without that even full Android compatibility would have been crippled one and not a viable solution for a mobile phone.

                2. No N9 sales numbers were ever released. Nokia only commented that Lumia sold more than N9 in a matter of weeks.

                3. Nokia didn’t make Symbian sales collapsing with 112. They were collapsing because Symbian was no longer a competitive product. This has been proved. Symbian was destined to collapse.

                4. Nokia was not able to use Android in early 2011. This was already proved. Just in late 2010 Nokia said how using Android would be like pissing in the pants.

                Yes.

                I proved all your point invalid.

                I’m glad to educate you this way. No need to thank me for this.

                • Thomas F

                  1. No, but they could have..

                  2. The n9 was sold in milions, that is A minimum 2 mil. If you take that number in relation to the number of people in the markets where the N9 was lunched, you will see that the N9 was chosen over the L800 by the custodes..
                  3. Agree that Symbian was not doing well, but the burning platform memo speeded up the proces.
                  4. Perhaps it is good to pis in your pants, and enjoy it, if you make sure you have A clean pair waiting.

                  So mr. Educator, you should thing of what could have been done….

                  • Random Random

                    1. Yes. Nokia could have but was not going to. There is a huge difference in that. For example, the Android compatibility for the launch was not going to happen.

                    2. A minimum of 2 millions is just a fabricated number. The unit sales for N9 were never released.

                    3. There is no proof that the memo really accelerated the process. Apparently there were some minor sales missing after that but there is really no proof of the collapse happening because of the memo. Actually, the collapse was happening and the memo really changed nothing.

                    4. Nokia said Android was not an option and they badmouthed it in late 2010 just before 112.

                    Yes, I educated you again. Continue to read my posts and you can learn.

                    • jiipee

                      Engineers are not typically the best educators.

                      1. Do you know that for a fact? It could have been even bigger news, if they had introduced the Android compatibility later as a ground-breaking hyper-innovative approach.

                      One does not need Google Play store. Just look at Kindle fire and Xiaomi. http://thenextweb.com/asia/2013/08/12/chinas-xiaomi-sells-100000-units-of-new-130-phone-in-90-seconds-chalks-up-7-45m-reservations/

                      2. Mr Skillman seems to have removed the entry in tumblr, but he has clearly said that N9 “sold in millions”.

                      3. The profit warning that came after Feb’11 proves it. Nokia had no knowledge of Symbian crashing in Feb ’11. Had they known it, they should have sent out a stock exchange release as stated in the Finnish law. That would have also been a perfect method to raise the feeling of need to change that any CEO would have used. Go and ask any friends you know in the sales channel, what the effect was. (“ok, Nokia does not want to sell Symbian anymore and the competitors just started to push volumes competing with price”)

                      4. What does that proof? The management was changed afterwards. Nokia for instance had N9 running Android and there has been people in this forum, who have confirmed that Nokia were making Android apps probably as testing and risk mgmt purposes.

                    • Random Random

                      1) I know for a fact that Nokia was not going to make MeeGo Android compatible in the launch.

                      2) Kindle is not a smartphone but a tablet. I have several times mentioned Kindle in my messages because too many people are so predictable, but this time I forgot and I had to mention it now.

                      3) In millions can be one million. Sold millions would be at least 2 millions. Sold in millions means at least one million. Then again, so?

                      4) Several reasons. Badmouthing, no Nokia Maps to replace Google maps, no special access, no way to replace Google’s services, too arrogant and yes Nokia badmouthed Android too much.

                    • MF

                      You want Nokia to become like those Chinese OEMs selling $100 phones? Seriously?

                      So now, when it comes to forked Android, having 1 million apps available is suddenly not required but it’s a deal-breaker for Windows Phone?

                    • jiipee

                      1. That is good info, thanks.

                      2. So you are saying, that Nokia could not make a deal with Amazon on sharing their app store?
                      What about Xiaomi, or was it too difficult for you to answer?

                      3. I think we need someone English speaking to comment on the “in millions”.

                      4. “no Nokia Maps to replace Google maps” That is not true. Amazon bought Nokia maps to Fire.

                      And currently the third ecosystem is non-Google-Android, where Nokia could have been the primary mapping platform. http://conversations.nokia.com/2012/11/07/building-a-global-mapping-platform/
                      The communication could have been about the good Android without Google crap. Elop is smooth talker and he could have twisted the story easily.

                    • Random Random

                      3) Yes, I’m sorry about the quality of my English but since it’s not my native language, you have to understand why it’s so crappy from time to time. I’m sure native speakers are just devastated by the errors I make.

                      You are right about someone native commenting about “in millions”. Does it mean at least 2 millions or is it a way to say that the quantity is at least one million. In the Finnish language we have a word “miljoonaluokkaa” (for example “Hänen palkkionsa oli miljoonaluokkaa”) describing that that something was at least one million. I would be interested to know how someone would translated that without saying seven figures of something like that.

                      2) I can’t possibly know what that would have required. However we can look it this way. Nokia wanted to be the leader or (or and) to save a considerable amount of money. This is

                      Working with Intel on MeeGo was intended a dream come true. Sharing costs but gaining on research speed. However Intel wasn’t that interested in almost blindly following Nokia on the research targets. It’s hard to say the reason for that, but apparently Nokia had presentation problems and they were not able to convince Intel about the development targets.

                      What is your opinion about that?

                      4) Not possible to replace Google maps and maintain access to Google Play.

                      Think about this. Nokia was not guaranteed to have early access to the Android code and that was definitely going to happen with forked Android.

                      About changing opinions.

                      Lots of people here in MNB hate people who change opinions and they are made fun out of. However without that almost any human is clueless, stupid and ignorant.

                      Nokia should have changed opinions and perhaps dumped maps if necessary.

                    • jiipee

                      “Working with Intel on MeeGo was intended a dream come true. Sharing costs but gaining on research speed. However Intel wasn’t that interested in almost blindly following Nokia on the research targets. It’s hard to say the reason for that, but apparently Nokia had presentation problems and they were not able to convince Intel about the development targets. ”

                      That is good input ad Id like to hear more. There clearly was power struggle within the consortium and Intel was not in 100%. Still, it was not only Nokia. Also, the market opportunity to push hundreds of device clones to market a la Symbian was closed and the Meego R&D would have been automatically less than Symbian due to more limited product range.

                      Agree with you on the mapping business disinvestment. It is already becoming bulk, fixed costs are high are there are no signs of profits. (read. I believe that an outside CEO was needed, but someone who knew the business.)

                      “Lots of people here in MNB hate people who change opinions and they are made fun out of. However without that almost any human is clueless, stupid and ignorant. ” I almost agree with that. The only thing I disagree is that I dont like such generalisations “people”. I reserve the right to change opinions, when I get new information. So far nothing suggest that Meego or dual-OS strategy would have done so much worse than all-in WP.

                      @MF
                      I think that you underestimate Nokia’s position in the market. They had the best coverage on operator billing. By teaming up with eg Amazon (and BB), they would have gathered plenty of apps.

                    • MF

                      It is stated that Nokia was on track to introduce only 3 Meego models before 2014. Did anybody actually have factual evidence to dispute this?

                    • Random Random

                      On track and planned were not the same thing.

                      Nokia had more than 3 MeeGo based devices planned by 2014.

                      However the problem was that the MeeGo team didn’t deliver when they were supposed to deliver and constantly missing deadlines.

                      The story, yes! the story is that the management extrapolated the delays and approximated (based on past performance) that they would end up with delivering only three models by 2014. Three models not including variations like phones with different amounts of memory and similar features.

                      Apparently Nokia made a realistic projection about what they would be able to deliver.

                      Yes.

                      There were much more planned models. However please tell me who thinks that Nokia was really able to deliver all that was planned for?

                      In time.

              • Andy

                I don’t think that would have been the case. Google didn’t consider Nokia as a threat because Nokia didn’t have a proper eco system. So, I don’t think Google would have allowed to port android apps officially to meego as that would threaten their Android OEMs market share. So Nokia wouldn’t have got the android eco system support if they have gone with Meego. Also, Nokia was bleeding very badly financially. So, they wanted someone to provide financial support(I still believe lack of this caused BB’s downfall). Since MS was ready to do that, Nokia went with WP. MS money came with a clause of exclusivity. So, Nokia have to stick with WP only.

                As far as BB is concerned, they do not have something like Nokia-MS partnership. So, the only viable option for them will be to go Android way. Probably they can have android for consumers and BB10 for the enterprise. They can even fork android and skin it with BBOS.

                • Thomas F

                  That part of Android is open source….

                  • Random Random

                    The access to Google Play is not open source and without that Nokia was not able to get enough applications.

                    All that was needed wad Google denying access to Google Play.

                    Even BB got a puny 30 000 Android applications and they really tried to get all the could.

                    • jiipee

                      How do yo know that?

                      Why are there plenty of Chinese OEMs selling truckloads of Android phones with no Google play on them?

                      Joining forces with Amazon for instance would have created big enough store for any Android developer to sell their apps also there. Notice: “also”. Google couldnt have blocked the devs to supply their apps to alternative stores. Those exist already today. You are too fixated to Apple ecosystem that you dont understand the difference to Android/Google.

                      Nokia could have even competed with their location based apps with non-Google Androids and get some revenue there since Google apps are not free (though can be sideloaded, if Ive understood rght) in those platforms.

                    • Random Random

                      Easy.

                      Please mention some of the manufacturers manufacturing those Android phones without the access to the Google Play.

                      Then tell us how much those are sold in Europe and the rest of the countries where Nokia has been strong in the past?

                      Yes.

                      Very low sales over there.

                      Nokia just didn’t have a chance to pick up Android. Mostly because they were too arrogant to do that.

              • Janne

                Thomas F:

                1. MeeGo could have gotten Android apps later, but realistically not from day one – and even then it was unsure if Nokia would have ever wanted to do it. It is also a very old question (that e.g. Steve Jobs felt strongly about), will suck tricks hurt your own platform’s software development and differentiation. One of the most thanked aspects of WP is that its apps are often unique to the platform in UI style etc.

                2. N9 was probably a somewhat easier initial sell than Lumia, it had a more familiar user-interface, heck it even had a more familar name for many Nokia buyers. Lumia was, for all its hype, a brave new world. That said, there is no proof N9 sold better than Lumia in the markets it sold in – for example in Finland Lumia 800 (just 800, not 710) made a far bigger initial dent in StatCounter than N9.

                3. On this I agree, although the memo itself was just bag image-wise, Feburary 11th itself did more damage. It didn’t cause Symbian crash, but it did unnecessarily accelerate it in my view.

                4. Disgree. No other major smartphone manufacturer has several smartphone operating systems in any kind of real manner (other than the Asha/Lumia kind of low-end/high-end pslit). Apple obviously doesn’t, Samsung is all about Android (and come on, don’t give me that half-baked WP stuff as proof of other operating systems) and so is HTC and the rest. Nobody does more than one seriously. It makes sense to focus on one smartphone platform at a time, because you can focus your software development/differentiation there.

                • Tom

                  Even a half baked Android would have been good for Nokia, like Samsung does with WP. If WP succeeds for some reason, Samsung will ramp up pretty fast. If just a vanilla android on same hardware can sell few millions, why not? They could have gotten valuable experience on Android as well for very little cost. If Nokia can maintain WP+ s40, why can’t it maintain WP+S40+Android?

                  I think the CEO’s need to be rational and have proper risk management strategy, unlike Elop. Following something blindly is what religious fanatics(or fanboys) do. It’s not desirable for a big corporate CEO.

                  • BEN

                    half backed android would do nothing for nokia. so please what. Elop is the one who is taking a good risk. don’t be blind by android fanboys.

                  • Janne

                    It’s called focus.

                    Look it up. It’s a business thing.

                    It isn’t fandom.

          • BEN

            nokia would have been dead back then in 2011 if they did not chose wp. meego=doa, uncertain, half finished os, lack of proper ecsosystem, ovi music is not enough, sparse apps, it was like a wasteland, small sales, small niche users. it would been a niche and probably dead like BB.

            • jiipee

              NSN would have kept them alive ;)

              • ben

                Meego wouldn’t it would have killed their smartphones back in 2011 and will struggle very hard

                • Noki

                  could not have been worse than WP… that thing takes for ever to ramp up sales.

                  hint the n9 sold more devices than most Lumias single devices

                  • Random Random

                    What makes you think MeeGo would have ramped up any faster? MeeGo was starting from zero sales and without applications.

                    Nokia was not planning to make it Android compatible at the launch and all the later plans were also pure speculation. It was not reasonable to expect Android compatibility for MeeGo since Nokia had seriously badbouthed Android in late 2010.

                    There is no proof at N9 selling more. Nokia never released any official unit sales and pretty much everything else is just speculation.

                    • Noki

                      I KNOW IT SOLD OVER 2 MILLION, funny part I know you know that 2 ;)

                    • Random Random

                      Sure you know if you really really want to. If you want to, you can believe in aliens and that Elop is one of them.

                      Sure, if you want to believe.

                      However there is absolutely no proof that N9 sold 2 million units.

                    • Noki

                      I know because people in Nokia told me so… said it here many times. I’m pretty sure you work at nokia 2 (remember that screen-shoot you posted of “your” n808 ) so just ask people around they should tell you the same thing..

                    • Random Random

                      Oh, now you think I work for Nokia? It may surprise you but Nokia is not the only company using monitors, you know?

                      The point is that Nokia never released any official numbers and that’s the problem.

                      MeeGo’s problem was also the applications. It was not really going to get enough of those and Android compatibility was not really seriously planned for it.

                      Without applications it was pretty much doomed to have even lower unit sales.

                    • Noki

                      “Nokia is not the only company using monitors, you know?”

                      hhehehe how did you know its was the monitor that, sold you off ??? busted hahahahaha

                    • Random Random

                      Just explain that and I’ll tell you why.

                      Yes, there is a reason why I usually have the upper hand in these talks about products succeeding.

                    • Noki

                      trying to have the last word here so people wont notice you have just been BUSTED :D hahhahah, tell us was that really your 808 or did you got one from the devices cabinet hehehhehe

                    • Random Random

                      It appear you try to change the topic.

                      “What makes you think MeeGo would have ramped up any faster? MeeGo was starting from zero sales and without applications. “

                    • Noki

                      no I’m not trying to change the topic, YOU ARE!!!!
                      You are the one that should know better and come here to spreed FUD about things you should know and do know not to the true, thank you for proving it, I was not 100% sure till just a few minutes ago :D EPIC hahahah.

                    • Random Random

                      Sure, you keep sayig MeeGo was going to succeed without applications.

                      How nice.

                      A miracle OS. People happy just swiping around without applications.

                      Let’s say something I’m not going to link to.

                      In reality pretty much all studied showed it as a failure.

                    • Noki

                      you are really going to put random answers to of topic things so people wont notice the BUSTED part wont you? just give up change your nick and come back as some one else.. you will have to change your style of circle argumentation or people will know its you..

                      Don’t you feel ashamed to do this, wile at the same time you know you are flat out lying?
                      PLus you work there, did some one put up for this? worse is it just you? or is there a team of guys like you?

                    • Random Random

                      How little do you understand about the mobile world.

                      No wonder you were advocating something like MeeGo.

                      It never had a chance once Android surpassed Symbian sales. That was also the end for MeeGo.

                    • Noki

                      and he as done it again :D ahhahahah

                      you area funny BUSTED, soo how large is your screen is it the 27 inch one ??? I liked that one hehehhehe

                    • Random Random

                      Yes.

                      Only Nokia must be using 27″ screens if you say so.

                      This is how a true believer works. He picks something he wants to believe and sticks to that.

                      This is how you Nokia do it. You have faith.

                      Symbian was a religion and apparently MeeGo was another for you.

                    • Noki

                      yes the funny part ;) it was you that mentioned the monitor remember ;) hahahaha

                      Any way Jay it might be a good idea to nuke this entire thread, if this is more exposed Nokia gets bad rep for having staff spreading FUD.

                    • Random Random

                      Sure, and if you tell what so special in having a monitor, I can tell you the obvious reason why I mentioned it.

                      But then again, that obvious reason is probably too much for you to understand.

                      Yes.

                      I have the facts.

                    • Noki

                      “Yes.

                      I have the facts.”

                      apparently you also have the job 2, of having the “facts”

                    • Random Random

                      Yes.

                      You repeat rumors you have heard and when people don’t believe in those, you want to delete the entire thread.

        • BEN

          NO NEED. NOKIA AND GOOGLE NEVER GET ALONG FROM THE START WHEN NOKIA TRIED TO PATNERSHIP WITH GOOGLE, BUGGY ANDROID APPS ON A PHONE WITH A DIFFERENT OS DONT WORK, LOOK HOW IT TURN OUT FOR BLACKBERRY 10, CRAP, NO BODY USE THEIR NATIVE CODE APPS,UI, NO SWYPE UI, BUGGY, MISSING BUTTONS TO EXIT AN APP, VERY POOR LAGGY APPS MADE WITH JAVA DAVLIK. YUCK

        • jiipee

          That is interesting notion, since you seem to have inside information. Can you open it up more: who were considering it, with which partner or themselves, what did they think of Amazon?

    • Thomas F

      no apps alone is not enough. But Nokia hardware, navigation, Harmattan and android apps would have done the job

      • BEN

        NOT REALLY. HARMATTAN AND ANDROID APPS. NOPE. ITS ALL ABOUT THE ECOSYSTEM AND EXPERINCE AND A DIFFERENT UX/UI IDEA THAT STANDS YOUR PRODUCT APART FROM COMMON APP ICON PHONES.

        • Thomas F

          What has Nokia gained form the the WP ecosystem, that they could hot have gotten form a multi ecosystem setup?

          If you look at UX/UI i thing that Harmattan was the one that stood out… and that in a good way…

          • BEN

            No. WP UX/UI stands out from meego. meego was a bunch of icons and common notification centers from ios and android, the only thing it was different is gesture.

        • jiipee

          why dont they mimic that also with Asha range?

          • ben

            They already mimic that on their latest asha devices no need for meego

            • Noki

              afraid of meego are you? don’t worry they killed it. same as meltemy.. clearing the way for wp on that very same segment were most of the sales are coming from, profits nightmare.

              • Random Random

                MeeGo wasn’t a viable product and that has pretty much been probed.

                A viable product here is one that would have been able to maintain Nokia’s unit sales.

                MeeGo was not up to the task.

                • Noki

                  “A viable product here is one that would have been able to maintain Nokia’s unit sales.”

                  aka not WP obviusly

                  • Random Random

                    Of course not.

                    Nothing was going to make Nokia to maintain unit sales.

                    That’s because the company reputation was already ruined and only the low end customers left.

                    The low end customers who switched to Android as soon as Android hit the low enough price point.

                    • jiipee

                      Just like with WinMobile. I had one from work for a year and that stuff was discusting.

                    • Random Random

                      Yes.

                      I’m sorry if you were forced to use that crap.

                • Thomas F

                  And WP was?

                  • Random Random

                    Check my answer to Noki.

                    WP was cheaper than MeeGo.

                    • Noki

                      of course wp is cheaper, a platform that gives you no hardware leverage that only runs on limited hardware gives you a lot of that….

                      FACT Nokia loses money on the smartPhone area with an OS that virtually for now costs NOKIA zero.
                      BB is profitable width and OS that has to develop itself.

                    • Random Random

                      Yes, and how was MeeGo supposed to be profitable without any more unit sales WP had?

                      There is absolutely no proof that MeeGo would have had better unit sales. Just the opposite. All studies showed that without applications it was going to fail miserably and that was the end of MeeGo.

                    • Noki

                      “without any more unit sales WP had” its only you sating that that is indeed speculation, we will never know meego was released as a DOA a profitable one might I had, go ask people in your accounting department.

                    • Random Random

                      No.

                      It’s just not a speculation.

                      MeeGo succeeding as well as WP has is speculation.

                      MeeGo was considerable weaker than WP what it comes to making people interested about the OS.

                      First, lack of applications. As we know Qt was a failure and even you don’t know how big portion of BB’s native applications are pure Qt ones.

                    • Noki

                      Random change your nick again, and pretend you are some one else, you know you are spewing out BS and FUD… that we know you know it is… Soooo :)
                      Say hey to the guys there, not that I still know any one there now, but…

                    • Random Random

                      Your problem is that I pretty much have facts and I know what was very probably going to happen with MeeGo.

                      In the end going MeeGo was a horrible mistake. Nokia should have continued with Maemo.

                      But hey, guys like you just can’t understand when it’s too late.

                    • Noki

                      Facts??? I know and we all do know that you are not a developer, you couldn’t understand the “facts”, you are probably some one from a marketing dep. if you were a developer you would know that maemo and meego are mostly the same thing as far as development was concerned, there were political problems but what we had in the n9 was for the most part a maemo compatible with meego. not that it matters greatly to any one its just standard Linux in the end DEBvsRPM is mostly an implementation detail.

                    • Random Random

                      Sure, going for MeeGo just for no reason prevented Nokia from releasing a MeeGo phone in 2010.

                      You apparently don’t understand how much it mattered that Nokia failed to release a MeeGo phone in 2010.

                      In 2011 it was all just too late.

                    • Noki

                      Random and Jay, please nuke this thread its probably a bad idea to let it open bad marketing for Nokia and all, so I suggest Random changes his nick again, and this thread gets deleted. I wonder how many more “randoms” the are commenting here on MNB?

                    • Random Random

                      Apparently you said something making you look so bad that you don’t want the world to see it.

                      That’s why you are trying to censor this thread.

                      Yes.

                    • Noki

                      noooo but hey its your joob I’m concerned about, is your behaviour sanctioned by NOKIA?

                      I doubt it is at least publicly it will never be, so there is oblivious problems here. think its a good idea to just nuke this entire conversation as its really bad marketing for NOKIA

                    • Random Random

                      No, this is really bad for you since you obviously can’t defend your views on N9.

                      Because they are apparently fabricated ones.

  • mark

    I liked the idea of the joint bid MS and Nokia were going to do previously.

    MS gets the software and Nokia gets the hardware.

    • Tomi

      ms wp8 isn’t that good. Meego does everything better.

      • BEN

        NOPE WP8 IS MATCH FOR NOKIA. MEEGO DOES NOT DO EVERYING BETTER. ITS DEAD UGLY ICONS BORING STALE, NO APPS, NO ECOSYSTEM. SO SHUT UP

        • jiipee

          could someone from MNB edit these comments to lowercase?

  • Mariano

    open the OS MSFT

    • BEN

      no, don’t want it to be like turdroid malware

  • Noki

    bb is considering this… BB ” formed a Special Committee to explore strategic alternatives to enhance value and increase scale in order to accelerate BlackBerry 10 deployment. These alternatives could include, among others, possible joint ventures, strategic partnerships or alliances, a sale of the Company or other
    possible transactions.”

    #note “in order to accelerate BlackBerry 10 deployment.”
    repeat accelerate BlackBerry 10 deploymen

    Aka everything, the most probable would be going private aka removing he stock out of the market. witch it can finance via the stockpile of money they have + the real estate + the zero debut they have.
    The second is trying to find a partner to licence/share the bb10 platform and manage to get them some more market share specially I suspect on the lower range price devices that BB as no interest on from a sales perspective…
    Selling BB not sure there would be many interested company’s, given that BB targets a specific range of users.

    and since its unlike others a profitable company it should be easy enough to do so…

    as for comparison of sales please compare bb10 sales numbers with the wp on nokia, or compare the market share transition of old bb7 to bb10 versus symbian to wp…

    • jiipee

      The hard part is that the only really growing payers are Chinese and I dont really see them using BB.

      • Tom

        They can .. and I think Lenovo is a potential candidate. It gets them lot of patents and other technology.

  • Souvik

    is there any lumia 1020 sales figure available??

    • http://twitter.com/haranguemnb Harangue

      Nope, it is only sold in a few countries right now so even if there are sales numbers they’re quite meaningless. Also, it’s a niche device, it will never sell Galaxy like numbers.

      • BEN

        its not a niche device. galaxy zoom is a niche device. it will sell better than some galaxy devices. their is no such thing as “galaxy sales numbers” in nokia

  • Keith too

    Unfortunately the only thing BB has that is worth any value are its patents. Its OSes are completely worthless.

    • Janne

      QNX has value in the embedded space.

      • Noki

        yes it was profitable before bb bought it and remains profitable after.

  • *****

    I would actually argue that Blackberry’s demise is completely different compared to that of Nokia.

    Blackberry’s success was fundamentally different than Nokia’s or Motorola’s. Where as Nokia and Motorola’s success was built on consumer acceptance (just like Apple’s success now). Blackberry’s success was built on the fact that there were “no credible alternatives”.

    In fact, compare Blackberry’s success to that of the Thinkpad or Hummer.

    There used to be a time when the Thinkpad dominated laptops. Everybody from the business man in a business suit, to the programmer at a big software company, to the coffee shop hipster had a Thinkpad. Thinkpads were pretty much the ONLY good laptops back in the 90s. Hell, the thinkpad barely tried to attract consumers (unlike dell or hp). Yet they were still successful, because most other laptops at the time were crap.

    The same thing happened with the Hummer. There was a time when it was the only decent SUV you could have bought. It wasn’t comfortable, fuel efficient, or even good looking. Yet it was popular for a time, because it was the only good SUV.

    When the competition caught up, the thinkpads and hummers went back to becoming nich products, as they were originally designed and marketed.

    Blackberries were originally targeting the enterprise nich, they found mainstream success because of their email and qwerty keyboards. But once the consumer focused competition caught up to Blackberry, they went back to becoming a nich company.

    • jiipee

      +1

  • prashant

    Nokia and Microsoft are my favourites.

  • xxx

    Windows Phone is growing? The WP market share hasn’t changed for 2 years, and it’s not profitable. It’s sinking platform, Elop burns it out. Financial situation of BB is much better than Nokia. Why are you happy? Look into Nokia garder.

    • Random Random

      If it has not changed for two yeas, that’s better than it was with Symbian.

      Symbian was losing market share. Rapidly losing market share before 112.

      • xxx

        Yes. Compare high income and sales result of symbian phones (100 mln s^3 and s60v5/3) in 2010 and poor sale result of all WP phones in 2012/2013. Nokia with symbian was profitable and was able to sell more and more. WP/WM fall from 12% to 3% today, and is unable to grow up. Every chinese manufacturer makes more smartphones than Nokia today.

        • http://mynokiablog.com Jay Montano

          Only anecdotal, but everyone I knew (non geek) that tried S60V5/S^3 did not want another ever again. The price was good but the user experience was dreadful. It kinda felt like a trap where Nokia might have got sales once but not again.

          You lump WP in with WM to show it’s failing. How about WP on its own?

          • BEN

            DONT BE STUPID, WP SALES HAVE BEEN RISING OVERALL. SO PLEASE DO SOME RESEARCH AND NOKIA quarter sales of wp smartphones have been rising.

            • xxx

              S^3 sales was also growing, but it wasn’t an argument to keep this system alive (52% from 2009 to 2010) for Elop :).

              • Random Random

                Symbian^3 sales were not really growing in Q4 2010.

          • xxx

            I think s^3 had a chance to sell good (nobody was able to stop android, there are hundreds android manufactures all over the world), for example 4 mln N8 has been sold in Q4 2010. Compare it to Lumias in Q4 2011 and 2012. WP+WM was added by me to show how much Ms lost during last 3 years. Transition to WP was very costly for both companies. None of them has profits from this transition.

            • Random Random

              Nokia never released unit sales indicating that 4 million N8’s were sold. That number is most likely fabricated and not true.

              At best it’s a guess.

              What we know is that Symbian^3 was not able to stop Android. No, Nokia continued to lose market share once Symbian^3 started shipping.

              • xxx

                Fabricated by Nokia, Toni Ahonen, Gartner, Wikipedia? Apple is loosing market share but nobody is thinking that ios is a burning platform. Maybe apple should stop making iphones in your opinion and perform transition to WP?

                • Random Random

                  Yes, that 4 million was a fabricated number. If you think it’s not, please give the original source for that.

                  I’m sure the original source dates back to very late December 2010.

                  About Apple.

                  Ignorant people don’t get this. Just as I have said, Apple should consider changing the strategy if they lost market share, unit sales in the high end and a major share of the profits.

                  With Nokia all that happened.

                  Nokia was just collapsing and Symbian was just not a competitive product.

        • BEN

          it beaten some OEM Chinese in sales, please shut up. nokia still the second mobile maker in the world, its `5th largest smartphone maker in the world, so I don’t see nokia as small.

        • Random Random

          Nokia’s Symbian sales were collapsing in 2010. Losing market share in every price range and rapidly losing unit sales in high end and in mid range.

          Without changing the strategy Nokia was destined to lose profits in 2011.

          Do you even understand what it means that Nokia was destined, yes really destined, to lose profits in 2011 if they were using Symbian.

          This is not about guessing. It’s a fact.

          Nokia was going to lose profitability if they were using Symbian or MeeGo.

          • jiipee

            AI agree that, just like what has happened with WP. Another thing is, if it had lasted as long.

          • GordonH

            “Nokia’s Symbian sales were collapsing in 2010. Losing market share in every price range and rapidly losing unit sales in high end and in mid range.”

            Symbian sales were…. oh no need to reply, waste of time.

            • Random Random

              Yes.

              Symbian profits were coming down and even Nokia has admitted that they would have gone to red with or without 112.

              Symbian was just dying in 2010.

              Nokia was destined to fail with Symbian.

              That was because it was an uncompetitive product.

              • Noki

                “That was because it was an uncompetitive product.”

                seeing as Nokia is going the same exact path with WP minus the profits part, (lumias are still like they always have been a money sink) then wp is an “an uncompetitive product”

                • Random Random

                  Sure, it’s a new product just like MeeGo would have been.

                  Compared to the old players anything new is usually uncompetitive at the start.

                  MeeGo would have started from zero sales and it would have been growing like WP did.

                  Symbian was turning unprofitable in 2011 no matter what. There was no way of stopping that.

                  • Noki

                    so we agree, wp is an uncompetitive product

                    • Random Random

                      Compared to the Android and iOS it has been as competitive as MeeGo would have been.

                      Yes, on that we can agree.

                    • Noki

                      “as been as competitive as MeeGo would have been”

                      complete speculation, unlike the 2Million sales

                    • Random Random

                      2 million, in what time frame?

                      Even if that was true, it would have been a true failure even on limited markets to have that kind of sales for a product with proper advertising.

                      Yes. MeeGo has a decent advertising budget and people actually saw ads. Maybe not people like you if you don’t watch television or pay attention to billboards.

                      Back in the days people wanted to have Android or iPhone. Anything else was just not going to do it big.

                      And that’s not speculation.

                    • Noki

                      remind us how many lumias have been sold so far??? divie that by the number different Lumias there are… result…. N9 as sold more than most, incredibly good for an overpriced niche low speck crappy screen DOA limited availability phone

                    • Random Random

                      According to your claims iPhone sold more than N9 in it’s lifetime, only in Q4 2007.

                      At the time iPhone was not heavily advertised by Apple and it was tryly hated and bashed by old smartphone fans.

                      In 2011 market had also grown but the unit sales of N9 were not that high. Even with advertising and with the new Swipe UI.

                      Remember that iPhone had no apps in Q4 2007. Nokia N9 had at least some.

                      The iPhone as also more expensive than N9 was.

                      Now compare N9 to Lumia. In 9 months Nokia sold 7 million Lumia devices. Compared to the claimed 2 million. That’s too big difference to be explained with limited sales regions.

                      What a failure that N9 was!

  • xxx
  • Sefriol

    The old story: too little too late. Nokia needed partners for MeeGo back in 2010 and BB tries to find them now?

    • jiipee

      Too late for BB since the business they are in is totally different. Business vs consumer markets work with different logic and B is mostly built around business.

      I will be one of the first ones to queue for the Nokia 2010-2011 books when they are out. It’s going to be very interesting reading, which companies were planning in joining Meego and why it didnt happen.

      • Sefriol

        I think Samsung and others were willing to join, but Nokia thought it wasn’t fast enough. They needed a major supporter for their strategy like Microsoft which was willing to throw huge amount money to make WP competitive.

  • dss

    Google, Apple, and Microsoft won’t allow anyone else in the game.. one by one all other software platforms are going to be gone…

  • BEN

    After the Nokia/Microsoft 5 year deal 2011-2016.
    I want Microsoft, only Microsoft to buy nokia private, use it as its main smartphone oem & tablet, callobrate with their surface devices and smartdevices that nokia has been doing ideas for watches,glasses etc. and other Microsoft hardware, except xbox division. it will change Microsoft old distate brand image, into a refreshed company since 2011/2012. THE COLLAB OF QUALITY HARDWARE MATCH, BRIGHT VIBRANT MIMALISTIC MICROSOFT DESIGNS & NOKIA. THEY FIT IN LIKE A PERFECT COUPLE. PLUS PATENTS ADVANTAGES OVER COMPETITIORS, THAT WILL KILL THE COMPETTIOR ESPCIALLY THAT SAMSUNG/APPLE. SO im not talk BS. im talking greatest opportunity in mobile history. nokia fits well quality hardware, best map services and the Microsoft rich ecosystem and best enterprise systems and cloud. I don’t want nokia ending up with someone else hands not even a “made in china” company please. It will boost Microsoft edge in the mobile space, advantages and marketshare & mindshare and the brand image = Lumia for windows phones smartphones & phablets
    surface = windows tablets, laptops etc.
    Xboxes, Microsoft tv hardware, screens, computer screens
    BTW nokia has the biggest mobile patents of all, even can get NSN, into Microsoft patents, and Microsoft have the advantage over its competitors. I’ve never seen so much collab in any company than I’ve seen with nokia & Microsoft. Google wasted 12 billion broken Motorola don’t compare to this collaboration.

    • jiipee

      I like your idea to some degree.

      It could be great, if MS purchased Nokia’s smartphone operations and would use it to design and manufacture awesome devices. That could speed up the development.

      Nokia could then consentrate on finding new markets to explore and innovate.

  • BEN

    so please move on. BLACKBERRY IS YESTERDAYS NEWS
    REST IN MOTION BLACKBERRY
    1999-2013.

  • BEN

    Blackberry Limited (Company)
    REST IN MOTION
    1985-2013
    HAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAH
    BLACKBERRY IS DEAD THANK GOD. PRAISE THE LORD.

  • ADM

    Nokia offers hardware and Blackberry would offer software. This might work. Windows Phone is great. We have 3 WP phones at home but WP is not offering features like BB10. Even my old C6-01 is more usefull in some issues. Simple things like file browser, true multitasking…

    • BIG

      Wp offers more than BlackBerry in the enterprise market. Mate more business apps and more developers and microsoft business enterprises that BlackBerry can’t match and future updates that will kill BlackBerry forever. So please BlackBerry is dust

      • jiipee

        That is true, I can relate to it.

        The sad thing is that also Ios and Android are supported by MS’s enteprise software and so far SAP etc are mainly pushing Android and ios.

        • ADM

          Well, I am not talking about enterprise market. I am talking about usability which BB10 offers to regular users. With Nokia’s name in it’s home – Europe and Blackberry’s name in NA this mixture might be beneficial for both sides. But first of all, Nokia needs Finish CEO…

          • BEN

            Microsoft Europe take the nokia division and use a finnish CEO, its new HQ in finland where the Microsoft mobile nokia divison if Microsoft buys nokia. BB10 doesn’t offer usability to regular users, its nothing compared to the usability that windows phone offers. Blackberry is dead, topic finished, end of story.

  • http://Twitter.com/mose_n N8User

    BlackBerry shouldn’t die

  • AdriiLeanz

    i think it wud be a great idea if nokia could buy BB and fused it with their asha lines

    • ben

      Buying blackberry would cause chaos. Blackberry as a company i have to say is worthless. All they have liable is patents that’s it. The whole company is dead stock. Nokia don’t have money to waste on a bastard company. Blackberry did see it coming i knew last year since blackberry os getting old, same old qwerty phones no smartphones and blackberry 10 annoucement, i knew back in 2012 RIM (blackberry) was going to die this year and struggle, they have been many talks on buying out the company in news, but their were rumors. Their recent sales so far blackberry 10 their first smartphone very late especially for year 2013, too late for blackberry. 2 million in q2. Crap. No budget or mid range enough blackberries. Then today blackberry is just dead. Dead on arrival now.

      • Noki

        reminding you that bb10 sales are way better than WP/lumia ones in comparable lunch quarters specially if you factor in ASP.

        • BEN

          Do some research Blackberry 10 sales were poor compared to windows phone 8 launch and wp7, Blackberry 10 launched with 500,000 million units compared to Lumia 1 million launch sales and 1.5 million windows phone launch sales.

  • linkin

    Emmm,here we go again,elop didnt disarm nokia,nokia disarmed themselves.if nokia had reinvented symbian when they needed to and did not become too confident at the top,there wouldnt have been a need for stephen elop in the first place..elop inherited a stale nokia..and you talk about licences,what about samsung and andriod??,samsung is even becoming a brand name despite the fact that google owns the andriod system…lets face it,i dont like elop,all.am sayin is the guy should be commended for once. i know something amazing is cooking up.

    • BEN

      you know nokia is cooking up something amazing this fall and next year. your mouth will drop and you will rush to the shop and buy. don’t underestimate the power of nokia and Microsoft, this fall I don’t see lacklustre with nokia and Microsoft.

  • D Harries

    Blackberry had enterprise software and qwerty keyboards.

    But so can anyone else. Going phablet size with qwerty might be it for BB. Need something individual

    • BEN

      nope it would be bad. phablet qwerty is mad, uncomfortable. visual touchscreen keyboards with its accuracy improvements making blackberry qwerty keyboards obsolete, blackberry is so 2004.

      • D Harries

        Okay. I’m not a BB fan. Just hypothesising. Natural partners for BB I think, are cash rich Samsung, both flogging Android, or LG/HTC who want more market share. Opportunity to offer tiered product range.

        Phones are getting bigger though….. The downsize from computers to phones. You need to test the market with some ideas.

  • n8thebest

    No surprise here, Blackberry is finished.

    • Random Random

      It would have been Nokia’s destiny if the chose MeeGo.

      Unfortunately MeeGo was not going to get enough applications.

      That’s because Nokia’s mobile Qt strategy failed.

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