Qt lead team: Elop has brought lot of fresh ideas how to do things

| July 15, 2012 | 139 Replies

Here’s a comment from jiipee at our comment section.

Suprise, suprise!

I’ve got something positive on Elop ;) I already posted this to a blog, but here it comes:
“Don’t agree with guys who claim Elop is the worst CEO ever. He has brought lot of fresh ideas how to do things.”

https://twitter.com/eeropenttinen/status/224141846354468864

Eero used to be a key person for Qt (eg team lead on Qt for Symbian) and he posted also this earlier:
“@tomiahonen thanks Tomi, we did our best. We gave all we had with best guys to make a dream become true, but now that’s over.”

Category: Nokia

About the Author ()

This account is for the stories readers from MNB submit to tips(at)mynokiablog(dot)com as ready to publish articles. Email tips(at)mynokiablog(dot)com if you have a Nokia related story you've written that you'd want to share with MNB's readers. For more information, check out http://mynokiablog.com/tips/ Tips/Guides/Rules for commenting: http://mynokiablog.com/2012/05/29/commenting-help-tips-guides-and-rules/

Comments (139)

Trackback URL | Comments RSS Feed

  1. Janne says:

    Jay, I really think it is time you put your foot down and put and end to this. Few simple ground rules and enforcement.

    These people are abusing the freedom of voice you are giving them. It is but a mission to them now to mess up the place.

    I wonder how many are paid for by some Korean PR department.

    • Key Lime Pie says:

      And you’re not paid by evil Elop?

      • Janne says:

        No, but clearly you are paid by evil Koreans.

      • noki says:

        At least some one should pay Janne for all his effort, how many hours a day you spend on this Janne? far to many IMO, I do it for the fun of it since for me is like watching a pronounced funeral, there is really nothing still in nokia that I relate to, so I’m just standing here watching things unfold just like we predicted they would.
        What about you Janne what ticks you to be here presenting alternative positive visions to every Flop fuck up?

        • Janne says:

          I actually don’t spend all that much time here. Like I said, I write fast – it comes naturally to me. Quick glance, quick reply here and there. The few longer posts of course may have taken an hour or two, like the Burning Symbian Blog and Nokia’s low-end strategy explained.

          As for your reasons for being here – are you sure they are the right ones? This is one thing I’ve been advocating against: the vigil holders, the case-studiers. You guys should just move on. There are people actually using Nokias and rooting for Nokia here. That is why I’m here. I am interested in Nokia’s and I respect Jay’s work as the absolutely best hobbyist Nokia user site around.

          And I think Jay really should start taking steps to enforce the peace. People who are no longer at all interested in Nokia’s products or building the community are just raining on everyone’s parade and making this one miserable place. Simple new threads like the WP BT/USB thread get terrorized into oblivion by people who clearly should have moved on, instead of staying and pulling down everybody.

          http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CNl5AnGBiA4

    • Janne says:

      Some very rough ideas to be further evolved:

      - Banning personal attacks of all kinds (calling people Elop apologists or Microsoft fans or whatever, that’s just inflammatory and more often than not very unjust). It has become a very bad habit of people labeling each other too liberally.

      - Banning ridiculing messages in OS threads, be they WP, Symbian or whatever, like we saw today in the WP8 BT/USB thread, people without any contribution there just bashing WP. Similarly no Symbian bashing in threads reporting Symbian news etc.

      - Third idea would be to stop all new blog entries on “past perpectives”. No more analysis on OPK, February 11th, burning platforms or Hitler. They serve no purpose, because they just blow up into a full-blown war. There is no ability to discuss them.

      I think these basic rules, printed on the side of the comment box, and enforcement by censoring the entire message to [removed for breaking rules] (not disappearing, that’s bad) would do wonders to our ability to actually have an adult conversation here.

      • noki says:

        Sorry whats the fun in that?, Semas to me just like burring your head on sand and pretending all is great…

        To me Its so much more fun to keep repeating “i told you so” because you know I did told you so and as a result was insulted in 30 different ways personally, and i abstained at all times from personal attacks to any one but Elop and even to Elop just to call him for what he clearly is, an incompetent.

        So lets just wait a few more day for another magnificent Q2 result under Elops perfect management…

        The news here??? probably Qt sold…resulting in a “thank you for not taking us down with you” note

        • Janne says:

          Yeah, but that’s exactly the thing. You keep attributing or hinting things on me in that post I never claimed or said, creating a need for me to defend myself for being claimed to have a position I actually never held. Elop’s management is not perfect and Q2 results probably suck.

          That is why I’m asking for Jay to step in and take control. I know he’s reluctant, but this has been going on for months, the inability to discuss with civility this stuff – and many threads get terrorized over and over again by bitter people who are just venting towards a completely innocent audience.

          In addition, the people doing the terrorizing freely admit they don’t even care for Nokia products or news anymore, they are just waiting for it to die.

          Why not leave us in peace. We know the odds are stacked against, but for our reasons we are still interested in Nokia, in Nokias products and being part of a Nokia fan community. Go rain on someone elses parade. Or preferably don’t rain on anyone’s parade.

          But it is Jay’s blog. He decides how to run it. I offer my perspective only.

          • noki says:

            “Elop’s management is not perfect and Q2 results probably suck.” and so we should all shut up???

            “Why not leave us in peace.” OO well call it a grudge personally I was insulted in every way possible way wen I stated that the path being taken would lead NOKIA here.

            A kinda “I told you so” that I have the pleasure to send to the countless WP “fans” that invaded Nokia blog after the memo, any way most of them are gone and by far the biggest individual spammer around this parts is you Janne, just the other day you managed to have almost 50% of the comments on a similar thread.

            has it occurred to you that maybe you keep people motivated to keep saying “I told you so” with your continuous, “the plan is good because everything was dead any way”? no? because it sure motivates-me to step in and say “NO”

            • Janne says:

              Right after February 11th I wrote here I wish they hadn’t done that. People who know me know how strongly I feel about that, more so than I ever formulated to strangers online. I still to this day agree with that. No doubt it was a mistake.

              It was a huge gamble and Q1 showed they failed to sustain Symbian as planned. Parts of February 11th announcement and the memo were failures of major proportions, with PR ramifications Nokia is still reeling from. I do understand Nokia’s rationale for doing it, and have explained that here, I just don’t think it was the right choice.

              And don’t worry, I doubt I’ll be “spamming” long things going this way. Better leave the place for people like you, who don’t care about Nokia anymore. The great contributors. Maybe I’ll find a place where people that comment actually still use Nokia products or plan to in the future.

              p.s. You know, if you are so bitter about being mistreated – the rules I was drafting up there would be in place against mistreating you too. What makes you think a place full of bitterness and bitter people is good for anyone.

              • noki says:

                Janne as you know I have the most respect for you even sympathy, you keep being correct and avoid personal attack on character, that is a good thing.
                Some how I thing you are a way better at argumentation than most WP/MS fans here, the accept the obvious flaws in advance so you cover your future argumentation, the way you some times play on facts and fiction and the dubious areas about future prediction and the way you drop an argument wen you realize its broken, makes you by far the best wp fan here, to be honest most of my discussions with you have been very fun, and I would like to think you had fun as well, it certainly seamed so to me at least.

                I understand your current train of thought. things are looking incredibly dark for nokia, and you think this flow of negative comments is the last thing nokia needs, but IMO think the people that read the comments section here are roughly hallways the same 20-30 people dabbling arguments to the death of nokia, and its has zero impact on nokia downfall. So enjoy the ride. I will 19 is just a couple days away, and you should expect the worse ever flow of negative Flop comments ever… remember you are not Elop don’t take it personally

                • Janne says:

                  noki:

                  I don’t think people on MNB have any impact on Nokia’s downfall. With that I agree. Also the reverse: I don’t think anything we could ever do here on MNB could have an impact on Nokia or Nokia’s decisions – unless maybe one of us were to gain a voice heard by some larger medias, which would afford some clout at least to analysts ears, but that is unlikely. Hence what we do here has an immediate effect only on the people who frequent MNB. We are affecting us. Us. We. You and me. All of us. We affecting us only!

                  And what we have here now is a miserable cesspool of people shitting on each other and getting more bitter at each other by the day, calling each other with all sorts of likely unfair labels and personal attacks and innuendo. Hence I am suggesting Jay take control and fix it up. He can do it, mostly he has to say a word and enforce it a little. Much of the problem could be fixed by taking away a little of the freedom people clearly abuse.

                  Because you know, number one: I think this place should service Nokia users. I believe that is what Jay wants it to do. And like it or not, that means increasingly Windows Phone now. I made the choice to tag along months ago and many of the critical voices here chose against that. The polite people left, because they were no longer interested. That is absolutely fair.

                  Yet so many bitter trolls remain that threads like this, or even the WP BT/USB thread, very quickly degrade into a flamefest of epic proportions. See for yourself, I have not contributed many messages at all to this thread, so you can not pinpoint it on me for example. It just happens, so many bitter people roam here just to create havoc and watch the “train-wreck happen”. Clearly much of the blame goes to Nokia’s PR failure, but we are innocent of that here. Why shit on us?

                  I have no illusions about where Nokia is at. Nor would I ever wish to silence productive discussions about everything ranging from positive to absolutely negative. But as you can see, there is no discussion here. There is no give and take. There is no hearing each other. There is yelling, labeling, ridiculing, being all kinds of asses. And I think that needs to stop for this place to continue to be of service to actual Nokia users and people interested in Nokia, not in Nokia’s downfall.

                  Because really, the only one this kind of action is hurting is us here. I’d hate to hate to move to WPCentral or place like that just to get away from the eternal bitterness.

                  • noki says:

                    “Much of the problem could be fixed by taking away a little of the freedom people clearly abuse.”

                    and this his how I know you come from a country that was not fascist for a period of time.

                    It hallways start like this, “we will temporarily remove some of your freedoms for the greater good”
                    Problem is that apart from the personal insults here, like calling some one Korean ;) (joke) all the rest I don’t see it being bad just argument swordsmanship, all good fun…

                    Specially now for the nay Sayers wen WP apologist ran out of arguments… If I would not know better I would say that’s the main argument to exercise censorship around here…

                    • keizka says:

                      Ever heard of Finnlandizierung?

                    • Janne says:

                      noki:

                      I think you are exaggerating by thinking that rules on a blog are steps to faschism. Perhaps if they come from the government (there is a big discussion in Finland about banning hatetalk towards minorities, in fact it is banned and has lead to some very questionable interpretations of the law – so I do get your point)…

                      But any “club” can have rules and those not following the rules will be outed. This is a club of sorts, and unless Jay wants it to be the personal ranting and venting ground of a bunch of disappointed (ex-)Nokia users, then some rules would go a long way towards making this place whatever Jay wants it to be. Of course that is absolutely Jay’s call to make.

                      Go to a restaurant and start an anti-Elop-protest there, and they will carry you out. Just because there is freedom does not you can do anything you like. With freedom comes responsibilities too. This is a privately operated site and part of the freedom in our world means the owner of the private site can say what goes and does not go on their private area.

                      As for “WP apologists running out of arguments”, that kind of talk is exactly what should be banned. Not because you can’t criticize WP or people believing in WP, but because that is such a loaded statement that it is bound to rub people the wrong way. Especially since there probably are very, very few “WP apologists” really here. Nor have they even run out of arguments, not really. That is just such an overarching statement that it makes no point, nor is it accurate, other than to insult. And the innuendo you added to it is just gross misrepresentation of what I am or have tried to contribute here. For the longest time I spoke against any rules, because I felt it warranted, I tried to ask people to behave themselves.

                      If the rules insisted that you actually put some thought into your words there, and explained the point in a way that would allow civil response and blame some mysterious group of people for something mysterious – it would would make for an actual adult conversation instead of a fight.

                      For example, instead of “WP apologists running out of arguments” had you tried something like this, I would have no problem with it, nor would I *ever* *ever* ask for it to be banned of removed:

                      “Now, that is has become apparent Nokia has not been able to sustain their business or and Lumia sales have been disappointing, arguments supporting that strategy have dwindled. …”

                      And then perhaps point to something specific one of us actually had said before, instead of making some broad-brush innuendo about mythical apologists without arguments. I know how frustrating it is, because I’m called an Elop apologist (and Nokia’s PR department) all the time and any attempts to explain my REAL position go unheard. Only very few people (thanks to them) ever really stop to appreciate when I explain my real view on Nokia, Elop and all. They just go on with their mistaken view, thinking that because I don’t think Lumia strategy has failed yet, I’m somehow apologising for a CEO whose PR blunder will probably resonate business for decades to come. I keep telling you: I never agreed with February 11th.

                      Yet, there it is, always, I’m an Elop apologist. And you probably consider me a WP apologist too. Just because I do like it (got my first WP7 two months before Nokia announced) and see certain merit to the strategy, and have been correcting many of misconceptions people have regarding it (because I have first-hand knowledge from many Nokia events including the AGMs of past years)… and I am called an apologist. But I am not. That is some caricatyre people have made and maintaining such talk is just insulting and not productive for the purposes of good discussion on a Nokia fansite. Same goes for Jay, in the WP BT/USB thread he too was attacked when discussing the highly flammable topic (what the fuck!) of USB and Bluetooth file transfer.

                      It is exactly that kind of unjust labelling and name-calling that must stop in my opinion – and would be the easiest thing to stop. Jay could just ask people to stop doing it. Most would and rest could be censored.

      • Yoyo says:

        Well Janne, maybe they should ban you as well while there at it. You seem to not realize that you reactions make a bad situation worse. You are always there to fight the fire with an bucket of oil. At first I actually liked reading your comments, they informative and enlightining. Now they are so annoying that i dont read them anymore. And to be able to annoy me one must trully go beyond any boundries.
        Just let people say whatever they wanna say, you reacting on them makes the matter worse because their comment gets more spotlight thanks to you.

        PS.: Asking for bans on a blog is really not done, no matter how right you are

        • Janne says:

          Of course I realize it. I’m not stupid. I don’t think it *only* makes a bad situation worse, though. But part of it does and that was one reason I didn’t partake in this thread really at all until these few notes.

          As for letting people say whatever they wanna say without reaction just underlines the fact that there is no discussion here. No give and take. People just want to rant. Nobody listens to anybody.

          As for bans, I’m not suggesting banning anybody, but I do think there ideas I offered might help make this a more hospitable place.

        • Janne says:

          And you know, there are a lot of people who are extremely annoyed (and don’t post as much as would benefit this place) by the excessive negative trolling and misinformation that gets spread in every possible thread here.

          For their sake, it would be good that something is done. If it includes shutting me up as well, fine that would be fair enough, but something needs to be done to get this back to the place it was.

          This is not good. Look at the WP BT/USB thread for example. And it wasn’t me annoying people there.

      • tomwhat says:

        Just a side note…for month old Nokia followers that were fans, believers & hopers of a free FOSS culture and products at Nokia were told to get simply over it… Meego would never had a chance, all discussions are nonsense, WP is probably the best. Now that many WP appologists are in a constant defense as well it’s simply clear that some rightfully blame Nokia and supporters of the Elop trojan game. It might be stupid but to repeat this in every thread! But banning this completely is nonsense. Read over it…

    • yesir says:

      Just wondering why you mention “Korean” in particular.. really surreally funny LOL!

      Things are getting more and more Monty-pyhtonesque everyday thanks to you, a real zealot.

      • yesir says:

        Janne, I think you should lighten up a bit.
        Despite the heat, we are all friends here..
        Why so serious? After all, people like good fight.

        • Janne says:

          That’s exactly it. This place is nothing more than a fight these days. Look at this thread for example. I didn’t even partake. A lot of it could be stopped by instituting some groundrules to ask people to behave and not post every idiotic comment. That would go for me as well, of course.

      • Janne says:

        yesir: Yeah, well that was a bit of a joke to counter all the surreal Nokia PR comments targeted at me. Apparently I’m a bunch of guys from Nokia PR or somesuch. People just throw all sorts of accusations around way too easily nowadays.

    • Epiquralis Patarakis says:

      Forgive me but: people DO HAVE freedom of voice and freedom of thinking. It is nothing to be given by you or anybody else. You can’t give me something what is mine already. I hope you got my point clearly. :)

  2. YOLO says:

    fresh ideas on how to destroy a company in 1 year & 10 months. nice job, elop keep it up

  3. outdated os says:

    I thought Qt was removed from a certain nokia event? That developer champion thingy…

  4. Rajiv says:

    Janne best troll ever, surpassed cod3rror
    you deserve an award for your performance and achievement

  5. skyfall says:

    Fresh ideas like selling how to shrink big organizations into a small company so that it will be apple vs google vs microsoft

  6. stephen ahonen says:

    censorship will do more harm than good.

    IMO, all the comments in this are still tolerable (except if it is read by elop himself)

    a posting with > 100 comments will boost MNB’s alexa rank

    Jay, what is your plan B if nokia goes bankrupt? mywpblog? myjollablog?

  7. vladest says:

    relax Janne. soon, when Nokia will be forgotten, Symbian/Meego/Meltemi will be forgotten, there will not be antagonists anymore and you can freely sing hosanna to wp/elop/balmer etc etc

  8. stephen ahonen says:

    it is not only at mnb, at gsmarena, commenters also bash elop

  9. stephen ahonen says:

    more tweets from jolla :

    @JollaMobile is ready to start announcing partnerships on the business front. The Ecosystem begins to grow.

    @JollaMobile is ready to start announcing partnerships on the business front. The Ecosystem begins to grow.

  10. Hurrah, that’s what I was looking for, what a information!
    present here at this web site, thanks admin of this web page.

Leave a Reply